Today we bring you an interesting interview with Zishan Manji, the young and ambitious CEO of Leads VIPs, who is making waves in the affiliate marketing space. Despite his age, 26-year-old Zishan has already found success in various online businesses, including dropshipping, lead generation, and pay-per-call affiliate marketing where he makes over $30 million per year.
He shares his journey, the challenges he's faced, and the valuable lessons he's learned along the way. Zishan emphasizes the importance of networking, staying consistent, and the mindset shifts needed to adapt to different business models.
Whether you're an experienced affiliate or just starting out, this interview is filled with great insights of online entrepreneurship.
This interview has been edited for length and clarity. Let's get into it.
Zishan Manji
Q: What first got you interested in doing online business? Why did you not want to just do what everyone else did?
A lot of my friends and family all had online companies, everybody was making great money. All my friends' parents had great businesses. I'm not here to tell a rags-to-riches story, I was not born homeless, okay? I was born just fine. I had a great childhood.
But not being able to match what my friends could do always bothered me a little bit. I came from a great childhood, but not like, huge, right? Some of my friends came from families that did way better, and I love that, and I appreciated that, and I never used that as envy, but rather I used that as fuel.
Because I didn't think that it was fair that X, Y, and Z could go buy a freaking Lamborghini, and I had a 2005 Honda Civic. That's not fair bro, right? You and I are the same age, that's not fair. So I was like, I need to fix this. And no one's going to help me, so I got to do it myself.
So since the age of like 13 years old, I have been self-sufficient. I've never had a job, not because I didn't have to, but because everything I was doing online supplemented my life. So I was just fine. And I started when I was like 13 years old. So it's been a long time. It's been a very long time.
I always do things that are harder than everything else. It's because the easy things go up high and then go low even faster. The harder things often last the longest, because nobody has the time to actually do it and nobody wants to. So if you separate yourself into doing the hardest thing, you're probably one of three people and you'll always smash it the absolute hardest.
Q: Give me an example of something easy in this case and then also something hard in the affiliate space or even like dropshipping and e-com, because I know you've done all these things.
So dropshipping is super easy. It's basically just uh, you borrowing ads and you just scaling up the products a tad bit higher. The harder thing I would say is actually building a relationship with the vendor and trying to get all the best shipping prices, all the best product costs, and maybe even holding inventory too. That's harder and nobody wants to do that. But that's another reason why you should be doing that, because at the end of the day, who is going to last the longest - you or the average drop shipper? Obviously you.
Q: How did you first get started doing dropshipping and what year?
I started playing around with Amazon and eBay back in 2014-15, when I was 14 years old. I used to buy wallets and other stuff on eBay and then sell them on Amazon. At some point, Amazon figured out that I was a minor and they kicked me off their platform. I then resorted to flipping vaporizers on eBay and this is how I got to my first 6-figures.
But as far as dropshipping, I started in 2017, so I was probably like 19-20 years old. In 2018, I lost my mother who was battling cancer and this was the turning point for me and basically what fueled me to take things to the next level.
Dropshipping was the easiest business anybody could have ever asked for. It's a bit harder now because everybody is trying to sell courses on it and teach it and all that. But dropshipping, you basically just took the best products, you took the best ads, you launched it up, and it just killed it.
Your ROAS was easy 4-5-6X all the time. After 2019, Facebook became an absolute ban hammer. So that was a whole different story. But pre that, it was the easiest cash grab that anybody could have done. If you even had a laptop, you would be rich. Like you don't even have to have fast Wi-Fi, you'll still be rich just fine, super easy.
Q: What was the biggest day you did in dropshipping?
I would say it was about $30-40k in one day promoting supplements back in 2016. I was partnered up with a company, so I'll take half the credit, but I was doing all the ads. So you can take 100% of the ads, I'll take 50% of the actual product itself. The product had already crushed it because they had already bought sponsored content from Kim Kardashian, Kylie Jenner, Khloe Kardashian. Using those celebrity UGC ads - it was obviously going to work for me afterwards. Back then it was a tad bit easier because there was less flagging and no frequent bans. It was so easy to just get up and just run it.
There's one like Josh Snow, he had Snow White and Floyd Mayweather, all these UFC guys, were promoting it, so he had the taste of influencer marketing so early. Josh Snow and another brand called Fit were the top, I'm gonna say, two guys that solely focused on UGC content. And that has always and always will be the best content too.
You get somebody else, for example - and here is a golden tip, right? Golden tip - if you get an old grandma, for example, let's speak about ACA, okay. Who won't trust the sweet old grandma? Everyone's going to! So use your UGC on your grandparents or who you trust, use them as actors. I'm telling you, you'll crush it. And that was a golden tip that we did during Q4 last year that took us from $120,000 a day to $260,000 a day in like 4-5 days.
Q: How did you get into affiliate marketing from dropshipping?
I had a lot of great contacts, great friends, and had great teachers. I can't ever forget the people that have helped me to get here. This space is about networking, right?
Meet as many good people as you possibly can, don't be an ass, share, because I'm telling you, you'll get it back one day - or in six months or in two years, who cares. One day it's going to come back to you, because the more you give, the more you're going to get. I believe that always.
Q: What's been the biggest challenge you've had between starting with dropshipping and then moving into lead gen, pay per call?
The biggest issue that I had was more about the mindset - going from trying to sell a product, going to finding a way to sell a service. It's a lot harder, right? For example, a huge product that I had was fluffy women's boot, okay? That product annihilated, it's because it was basically Ugg boots. Okay, so that had smashed for me.
And then going to service, like say, debt calls - that's a tad bit harder, because you're selling more on why you need to get it to help you, not why you should buy it because it's super cool. So for a hot dropshipping product, you want it because you just want it, it sells itself. For a service-based product, you need to go on the whole funnel, qualify, and then call in, which nobody wants to actually do. But if you have a great benefit towards that, you'll crush it.
Q: What's something that you believe a lot of people struggle with, with like pay per call or lead gen specifically, like getting things to work?
Consistency and networking. Okay, I'm often a shy guy too. But when it comes to stuff like this I try not to be shy, and speak to people. The best thing here is to have some happy juice. Have some kind of something to help you, and just speak to people.
Say "Hey, I'm Zishan, I do this." "Oh, so what do you do?" Start from there. I'm telling you, after two, three conversations, the gold starts coming. And then you drop sauce and so does he or she, and then you take it from there. And then that's how you build great relationships. Yeah, that's it.
Q: What's the secret vertical, what's the best one?
Okay, this is a fun one. So there is two answers. Are you searching for a cash grab, or to build an actual company out of that? Depends on you, right? Um, everyone knows about ACA, okay? Everyone that's here has done 8-figures with ACA, okay? That's a cash grab. No one could have predicted about all this stuff. Yeah, you could have studied Medicare and seen that CMS comes in in due time, but it all depends on you. If you are trying to just get a big cash grab so you're able to use that towards something else, hop on the hottest trends, same as dropshipping products.
If you are trying to build a business, do something really freaking hard, really hard, that no one's doing. Because the 95% of every affiliate is trying to make cash today and tomorrow. A big mindset change is required here and that's a big, big differential.
That, and on top of ad angles, right? Spy, spy a ton, and recreate. Do not copy. You don't want to be known as that guy that just rips everyone's ads. Use it as an example, and do it better. That's super key. The only secret is test more content. If you can test 400 pieces of content like we do every single week, any vertical is a little bit easier. Because the guy doing 20 pieces of content and he's struggling, cannot beat 400 pieces of content. That's a one out of 20th, good luck brother, good luck!
Okay, so that, and then doubling down on everything that is working, right? Don't get comfortable. $1,000 a day is not big. $10,000 a day is not big. If you're hitting $50,000 a day profit, you're a big shark. And at that point, you've dialed in.
Ad creatives are like a big pyramid, at this point. Say here is the smallest side, the bigger, bigger, bigger, bigger, right? At this floor, you're testing everything. You're testing angle 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5. Out of those 5, 2 will stick. Those 2, change up all the bodies, because obviously the script works, then you're able to find a bigger net. And then you keep honing in, and you'll have multiple campaigns at stupid ROI daily that you're able to scale. Because no one can do it better than you have, and no one can innovate as quick as you can too, and also no one can double down as quick as you can too, and recreate it exactly.
Your biggest expense in your team should be content. I am a firm believer in that, and I've learned that from all of my past mentors too, right? Content's key. If you test 200 and I test 10, who's going to win, okay? Who's going to win? All right, so... If you are a starting affiliate and you are making decent money, throw everything back into content. 'Cause I'm telling you, it's the easiest way to triple, quadruple in 30 days.
Q: What advice do you have for people who are starting out?
Try to go to every conference, but go there with a sole purpose. Don't just get there to get boozed up and talk, right? Go there to meet people and really just ask them, "Hey man, I'm 20 years old", "I'm 22", "25", "28", or whatever. "How can I help you? Or what am I able to do to help you so you can help me?" And that's the number one key tip, right? Don't just get and get and get and never give back. Everybody does that and it's so rude. It's like, I don't want to help you if you just used me on three phone calls and then you're just off for two years, like useless, right?
Chat with me, I'll help you, you help me. It's just like a hot girl, takes about two to three weeks to break that ice. Same thing for business - it takes the same amount of time to break the ice until you start to share the real sauce. That's where the value goes, right? It's not just saying, "Oh, I do this, you do that. Oh, sick, right? Cool." "Okay, show me." "I'll show you my ads and the LP, I'll show you the buyers, show me yours. Let's do it separately, but still together." That's the number one tip.
I'm also a big geek on studying everybody. So I've watched probably every industry podcast since 2019. I study everybody. I study everything. I don't have any days off, because I love what I do, not because of what the life gives me. It's because of the freedom of the thought that I have, knowing that I don't have to go back to doing something that I hate doing, right? Although this business is a tad bit harder and a more cash intensive, once you crack it, that high that you get is like no other.
Q: So if you were to speak to a young Zishan, that's in his teenage years or early 20s, what, what advice you have for them if they're thinking about starting?
The first thing I would say here is, right, fast money comes and goes even faster, alright? A lot of kids, including myself, made good money at 16, 17, 18, 19, 20 years old, right? If you are at that age and you're spending even a tenth of what you're worth, you're dumb. And the reason being, because when there's a slow period, you're going to regret it. 'Cause I see kids that make $400k and then go cash out $250k on a Huracan. Dude, that's half your money bro! If you crash that car, you're screwed, okay? You have to start from square one again. Yeah, you still have $150k left, but you're still screwed.
The only thing that I can say here is save, save, but invest smartly. Do not lock your cash into stupid things. Like, I think real estate is great, it worked for our parents and grandparents, for sure. It's still going to work, but I would say, if you're an entrepreneur and you want to do marketing, save your money, because cash is always king. And if you at least, for example, I have a lot of high cash in Robinhood Gold, it's FDIC approved to $2.25 million. If I keep, for fast math, say $2 million there at 5.5%, I'm guaranteed $110k a year, free money. I can live off that just fine, okay? I can buy the Huracan, I can rent a penthouse at $8,000, and I’ll still live free of charge. Everything else from your business is just icing on the cake.
So a thing that everybody wants to do is show off. Showing off, it's really, it's really stupid. Because I'm telling you, nobody cares. And it's only good at conventions. But don't go wearing Dior jumper, you look like a tool bro, okay? Wear a nice watch, okay? Come there and talk your business and wear a nice watch. People care for that more than your Huracan back at home, okay? Nobody cares. You aren't showing your... like, "Ah, Huracan!" I mean, nobody cares.
So for the younger people, save your money. Because when it is a rainy day, you'll still be very happy that you have your rainbow right there, right? All your money is there and you're able to diversify and don't have to stress, like you have to make it. Of course you do, but you don't have to live in that next day mindset, where basically you're scared of your next dollar. That's scary, and it's really stupid.
Q: Where do you see the industry going next, as far as affiliate marketing? Being more compliant, or going into grayhat verticals?
As far as the pay per call vertical, I think it was July 19th, CMS announced that ACA has to have a three-way phone call now with an actual health provider, health agent, something like that, right? We demolish ACA, but with that change, obviously there's a big disruption, right? So at least if I have two, three slow months, I'm not stressing, because I can still pay all the payroll, all the stuff, and be comfortable for another year, and not have to crack something and be like, "I need it, I need it", that's a great feeling.
Good, all the good things come and go, and they come quick, and they go pretty slow. Because honestly, each vertical takes about a year to two years that I've seen to have the big pump. Same for refinancei in 2020, I think it was, or 2021 or 2022. 2022 and a half to 2023, ACA, Medicare is still pumping too, it always has. But it's a tad bit harder to get cap for that, right? Because of the compliancy mitts and all that fun stuff, right?
Being on the trends, but also focusing on at least 40% of your time focusing on building the next big thing. 'Cause if you are first, you'll get all the cap.
Q: What keeps you motivated or what are you excited about right now even though you have basically already made it in life?
It's having the hunger and staying grounded If you can make a million dollars a year, and you are spending only $100,000, and you still have a comfortable life, it should motivate you to go try to hit $5 million, and then try to spend $500,000, and see how that life goes, right? asically, there's not much of a big difference, unless you choose to fly private and buy AP every two days. Yeah, your life can be very different. But for a normal person who had a normal childhood, making six figures a month is dumb money. And you're able to live comfortably.
As far as staying motivated, just always understand, right, you are not the biggest shark. You aren't the smartest person. There is a kid that's 18 doing $300k a day profit, okay? I know some of them. It's a big smack in the face, being 26 and nowhere even close to that. But it grounds you, because trust me, there's always a bigger shark. At the end of the day in life, it's you versus you. It's character versus character. You need to make sure that your character has 99 defense and attack, and so whatever else. Sorry for the corny joke, but the biggest man, the best man has all those attributes. They have the cash, the cars, the gym, and everything else that comes with that. If you want to be that guy, you need to grind your ass off, and you need to really put in the time, because it's a lot.
The affiliate space is so easy to make money, and it's even easier to spend it too, and lose it exactly. So you need to humble yourself because I'm telling you, there'll be a slow period, and you're going to say, "Shoot, I wish I saved." But if you still have all that money, and you need to diversify, and three out of four projects fail, who cares? You are still just fine.
Q: That's a great mindset. How can people connect with you?
@kingofecomm on IG, and Skype too.
Q: Alright, thank you for joining, man.
